[Platy]

Have you had times when you couldn't get an upgrade or paid seat in Qantas business class?!

On several occasions when I couldn't get a fully paid domestic business class ticket I asked how many commercial seats were for sale on the flight - the replies were 9 on 737-800 (12J) and 9 on a 767-300 (30J).

A surreptious peak at the manifest left conveniently in the forward gallery area alerted me to the fact that QF business class is often crammed full of their own staff - I have even been on a flight with 7 out of 9 occupied seats taken by staff on a 737-800!!!

Further investigation has shown this is the norm on the routes I fly. It appears there are two types of staff - subload and duty. I am told by the airline that subload are staff travelling in their own time and in theory they are not supposed to take precedence over

1. a full paying passenger
2. an upgrading passenger
3. seating preference for a paying for upgrading passenger

Furthermore they are not supposed to have seats allocated on a flight until 20 mins before departure.

Duty staff have precedence due to union agreements and absolute precedence is also granted to the airline managers and pilots ahead of customers.

No wonder fares are so high and have gone up 18.25% in 2 years! No wonder Qantas is complaining it can't make business class pay on certain routes!!! A significant portion of seats are non revenue! Furthemore, they are diluting their brand and creating a situation where cabin crew know they are serving principally their colleagues rather than paying passengers.

It's happening as well on international - I have travelled first class to Europe several times and witnessed the same staff faces enjoying their ride in first class!!! Does the airline expect us to pay $14,000 return when we know the cabin is a glorified staff junkett?

If you have had similar experiences please post them!

If you are unable to get an upgrade or paid seat you might want to consider asking the airline how many staff are on the flight - and especially whether any subload staff are there because YOU should get pecendence over them for paid, seats, and upgrades and seating allocation!!!

Incidentally, British Airways sell off their Club Europe (Business) seats at discount as restricted fares at anywhere between 25-70% discount!!!

[pvd]

That doesn't surpirse me.

I worked for BA for 3 months and its was clear that the Yes Minister view holds sway. the airline is there for the benefit of the staff and a few first class corporate customers. Not to mention those faceless & unaccountable people in yeild management

[NM]

Originally Posted by Platy

On several occasions when I couldn't get a fully paid domestic business class ticket I asked how many commercial seats were for sale on the flight - the replies were 9 on 737-800 (12J) and 9 on a 767-300 (30J).

This depends on who you are asking about the number of seats. The Global Res Systems have a single digit space to show seats per class. The airlines only load this field with a value that represents an "at least" value. Show it may show J9, but that means there are at least 9 seats available for sale. And some airlines load a smaller number, such as AA only ever show a max of 7 in their systems, so J7 would mean there are at least 7 seats available for sale, but may be as many as the full cabin.

I suspect that is why you are being told "9" on both 73H and 763 aircraft types. Look at an on-line GRS system such as ITN and you will see that QF load 9 as the max value in their class availability on all aircraft types.

Subload travelers will not show in the numbers on a system like ITN since they are truely standby. But if a J seat has not been sold, or become available 30 mins prior to flight due to a paying pax canceling or changing their flight, it will go to a subload flyer who has a staff entitlement to J. I am sure this happens very regularly. I know that I often change my flight times, expecially on the homeward sector of a return journey if I have finished my work early. That will free up a seat on the flight I have changed from, so someone who may not have been able to buy a ticket on that flight may find it odd that my original seat flies empty or is used for an op-up or subload standby passenger.

But I understand it can be very frustrating when you see what you have seen in the cabin. The best thing is to waitlist for the paid J fare and if there is a change up to two hours before, you may get on. But to waitlist you must have a confirmed seat either on another flight or in another class, so that may not always be possible.

[AlwaysUpThere]

U think Qantas is bad? (Well, they probably are but...)

A colleague was travelling from HKG to JFK on UA. Lucky to have a spare seet next to him on that very busy route. He was sounly asleep mid way through the night only to wake up and have an "on duty" flight attendant, not on a rest break, sitting in the seat next to him with the light on reading a newspaper and of course, chewing gum.

"Do you mind?" asked my colleague.

Reply: "Oh, I'll be done in a minute." :roll:

[drron]

18 months ago was flying LAX-AKL-BNE on Qantas having paid full business fare.At check in it was obvious that a lot of the business class was made up of staff and upgrades.Despite having pre -allocated seats my wife and I were told we had been re-allocated and could not be seated together,finally after much argument were given the 2 seats opposite the toilet upstairs.
Add to this no access to Qantas lounge-yes having paid full J fare and being a life member of the Qantas club.Plus waiting an hour on the ground after boarding to fix the air-conditioning and inflight having a non-functioning entertanment system.
So have not flown QF again.
On the funnier side flew BA from BNE-SIN about 10 years ago on a deal that if you payed for business class you would travel first.Just after take-off was approached by FA and asked if I would like the lobster for dinner.I asked why make a decision so early and was told we only have 2 lobsters and you and the gentleman behind you are the only 2 fare paying passengers-We both had lobster.No wonder first class out of BNE ended soon after!

[thadocta]

Hmmmm, this board seems to be filling up with posts from relatively new members describing experiences which those of us who use QF somewhat regularly have never experienced. A J passenger being denied lounge access before an international flight? I don't think so. Splitting up a couple who booked well in advance? I don't think so.

Any other BB's that people contribute to becoming infested with trolls, or just this one?

Dave

[Kiwi Flyer]

Agree some posts are odd. Could it be that some posters are upset over announced changes so want to stir things up with stories of how else they have been poorly treated by QF? :wink:

Not that QF is perfect, but still ...

[dajop]

Originally Posted by thadocta

Hmmmm, this board seems to be filling up with posts from relatively new members describing experiences which those of us who use QF somewhat regularly have never experienced. A J passenger being denied lounge access before an international flight? I don't think so. Splitting up a couple who booked well in advance? I don't think so.
Dave

Yeah I agree - a lifetime QC member with paid J tix, being denied lounge access in LAX - I don't think so - unless perhaps they arrived at the lounge when the flight was on Final Call.

[NM]

Originally Posted by dajop

Yeah I agree - a lifetime QC member with paid J tix, being denied lounge access in LAX - I don't think so - unless perhaps they arrived at the lounge when the flight was on Final Call.

And the OP stated this was LAX-AKL-BNE so that means QF26 which departs from TBI terminal at LAX. Now, TBI is not the greatest QF Business Class lounge, but heck, its still a lounge.

Now there was some mention recently that TBI is about to undergo some major renovations - and about time I hear you say. The story goes that they will build one large OneWorld lounge and one large Star Alliance lounge - one on each of the lounge levels. While these renovations are being undertaken, it is quite possible that lounge access may be severely restricted. Have these renovations commenced? I have not heard of such, and avoid departures from TBI so have no first hand knowledge for well over a year.

So unless QF (and BA, CX etc) make alternate arrangements for lounge access during the renovations, there may well be situations such as this where QP/J flyers don't have a lounge. In that case it is not a matter of being denied access, but just that there is no lounge available to use. I wonder what arrangements they will make for F pax at that time???

[Bob]

NM, I flew QF175 4 weeks ago and used the TBI lounge. TBI was not being renovated. Glad to hear it will be - it is a shocker and so is the lounge. I have resolved to forget the BN LAX flights from now on. a) no skybeds; b) TBI and lounge.

On the positive side, the QF staff at TBI went out of their way to be helpful.